"We've been at around 3-4% now for certainly the last five years since regular annual reviews, the number of BME coaches that have been undertaken and that's not just in terms of first team managers but in terms of assistant managers, head coaches and through to phase coaches within academies."
Those are the words of Stephen Bradbury, Professor at Loughborough University, in regards to the enduring lack of black or ethnic minority [BME] in the English Football League. Starkly, in the Premier League, only six of the 206 managers who have taken charge of clubs in the top flight have been black or ethnic minorities.
Bradbury and BBC Sport pundit and ex-Tottenham, Stoke City, Manchester United and West Brom forward Garth Crooks joined us to discuss the issue and the potential full implementation of the Rooney Rule that has had an impact in the NFL.
"They're saying basically that the game is not for them," said Crooks of the experience of BME managers that he has spoken to.
"They don't believe the game is very welcoming once they've left the field of play. Once their careers are over, they don't feel that even when they get their qualifications they are going to get a job in the game and I find that incredibly sad.
"And when I consider people like Andy Cole - Manchester United, England, Champions League winner - Sol Campbell captained his country, struggling to get jobs...no, I rephrase - struggling to get interviews for jobs, it's quite shameful."
He feels one of the problems is "an element of protectionism" and for those "not part of the network of the game", then it can be difficult.
"One of the things the Premier League has tried to do and it's working very well in the academies is to professionalise the game but that means dismantling the network and that network has been in the game for 60-70 years," said Crooks.
"To dismantle that will rob certain people, perhaps those who are not as qualified as they might be because it's who they know, but what it does in effect is it's those who are becoming qualified and being encouraged to qualify to be part of a proper system of appointment of proper professional positions in the coaching environment."
He also made the point that given the problems English coaches as a whole are facing, can the game really afford to ignore a vast swathe of those potential coaches.
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